The Holy Qur'an
In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful. Praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds, The Beneficent, the Merciful. Thee (alone) we worship; Thee (alone) we ask for help. Show us the straight path, The path of those whom Thou hast favored; Not the (path) of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray. 1 Alif. Lam. Mim.
2 This is the Scripture whereof there is no doubt, a guidance unto those who ward off (evil).
3 Who believe in the Unseen, and establish worship, and spend of that We have bestowed upon them;
4 And who believe in that which is revealed unto thee (Muhammad) and that which was revealed before thee, and are certain of the Hereafter.
5 These depend on guidance from their Lord. These are the successful.
6 As for the Disbelievers, Whether thou warn them or thou warn them not it is all one for them; they believe not.
7 Allah hath sealed their hearing and their hearts, and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be an awful doom.
8 And of mankind are some who say: We believe in Allah and the Last Day, when they believe not.
9 They think to beguile Allah and those who believe, and they beguile none save themselves; but they perceive not.
10 In their hearts is a disease, and Allah increaseth their disease. A painful doom is theirs because they lie.
11 And when it is said unto them: Make not mischief in the earth, they say: We are peacemakers only.
12 Are not they indeed the mischief-makers ? But they perceive not.
13 And when it is said unto them: believe as the people believe, they say: shall we believe as the foolish believe ? are not they indeed the foolish ? But they know not.
14 And when they fall in with those who believe, they say: We believe; but when they go apart to their devils they declare: Lo! we are with you; verily we did but mock.
15 Allah (Himself) doth mock them, leaving them to wander blindly on in their contumacy.
16 These are they who purchase error at the price of guidance, so their commerce doth not prosper, neither are they guided.
17 Their likeness is as the likeness of one who kindleth fire, and when it sheddeth its light around him Allah taketh away their light and leaveth them in darkness, where they cannot see,
18 Deaf, dumb and blind; and they return not.
19 Or like a rainstorm from the sky, wherein is darkness, thunder and the flash of lightning. They thrust their fingers in their ears by reason of the thunder-claps, for fear of death, Allah encompasseth the disbelievers (in His guidance, His omniscience and His omnipotence).
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Give all your bacon to the infidel Auburntom. He really likes bacon.
THE KORAN IS A TERROR DOCUMENT.
(Quran 5:33): The Punishment for those who oppose Allah and his messenger is: Execution or Crucifixion or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides or exile from the land.
(Quran 9:5): Then when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush.
(Quran 8:12): Remember Thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you: give firmness to the believers, I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers, Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger tips of them."
"And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah 2:193
76: 4): Lo! We have prepared for disbelievers chains, yokes and a blazing fire.
47:4): When you meet the disbelievers in the Jihad strike off their heads and, when you have laid them low, bind your captives firmly.
Oh this is great! Now, we need somebody to post the nasty parts of the bible. And then we can have somebody post verses from both the Quran and the Bible showing what loving religions there are. And of course, we need to talk about the crusades. I'll bet nobody has thought of this before.
auburntom,
Now you're just being a ham!
auburntom, OK. You're on:
- Burn all unbelievers, destroy their livestock and towns as a burnt offering; God is great! (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)
- If a man discovers his new bride is not a virgin all the men in town must gather and smash her to death with stones, in front of her father. (Deut 22:13,14; Deut 22:20,21)
- After committing genocide on the Arabs, God parcels out sex slaves to Moses' army by ordering the deaths of every boy child, and killing all women who are not virgins, but young virgin girls of any age can be kept alive for pleasure. (Numbers 31:17, 40)
- If your son back-talks you all the men of the city shall stone him to death with stones. (Deuteronomy 21:18-21)
The Bible also requires death (usually by burning alive or stoning) for:
- following any religion other than Judaism :(Exodus 22:20 -Numbers 25:1-15).
- for trying to convert a Jew: (Deuteronomy 13:1-10)
- for adultery: Leviticus 20:10
- for male temple prostitution: Leviticus 20:13
- for sex before marriage: Deuteronomy 22:13-21 (applies to women only)
- for sex with a woman and her mother: (Deuteronomy 20:14; all three must be burned alive.)
- for rape. If the victim isn't engaged, she must marry the rapist, who must pay her dad 10 shekels for her. If the rapist refuses, he is fined one sandal. - Deuteronomy 22:25
(it gets better...)
auburntom, OK. You're on:
- Burn all unbelievers, destroy their livestock and towns as a burnt offering to God. (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)
- If a man discovers his new bride is not a virgin, all the men in town must smash her to death with stones while her father watches. (Deut 22:13,14; Deut 22:20,21)
- After committing genocide on the Arabs, God orders the deaths of every boy child and women who are not virgins, but young virgin girls of any age can be kept alive for pleasure. (Numbers 31:17, 40)
- If your son back-talks you, all the men of the city should stone him to death with stones. (Deuteronomy 21:18-21)
The Bible also requires death for:
- following any religion other than Judaism :(Exodus 22:20 -Numbers 25:1-15).
- for trying to convert a Jew: (Deuteronomy 13:1-10)
- for adultery: Leviticus 20:10
- for male temple prostitution: Leviticus 20:13
- for sex before marriage: Deuteronomy 22:13-21 (applies to women only)
- for sex with a mother and daughter: (Deuteronomy 20:14; all three must be burned alive.)
- for rape. If the victim isn't engaged she must marry her rapist, who must pay her dad 10 shekels for her virginity. If the rapist refuses to marry her, he is fined one sandal. - Deuteronomy 22:25
(it gets much better...)
(sorry for the double posting.)
(contd.)
- The Hebrew God says anyone who doesn't worship him must be decapitated, and more horribly than al-Qaeda or the Taliban, their heads must be publicly displayed hanging in the sun. (Num. 25:3-4)
-Moses commands the murder of approximately 100,000 young males and roughly 68,000 helpless, innocent women and girls (Numbers 31:16-18).
Now consider your own family; how would YOU feel if a man claiming to speak for his God sent butchers into your house and hacked your family to pieces before your eyes?
The Bible orders or sanctions more genocide, rape, murder, chopping off of body parts and other vicious crimes than, I think, does the Qur'an. So don't be so quick to condemn the Qur'an when you can't ignore the Bible's repeated demands for genocide, child-rape, enslavement, murder, torture and the vilest atrocities imaginable. Even today terrorism and hate crimes are founded on religious beliefs, many out of the Old and New Testaments.
I keep seeing these old testament comparisons to the Koran.
What was the NEW testament about?
Didn't Jesus say something about tearing down the temple and rebuilding it in 3 days? What was that about?
I suspect that Islam is just awaiting reformation. They need a Savior.
lol gregcalac, that made me laugh.
Skeptic, thanks for being predictable. I won't make the claim that Islam is inherently bad or worse than Christianity based on its teachings, because it really all comes down to how people interpret it. What I do know is that when I get on a plane and they have to go through all my bags, and I have to leave my tools behind because they are potential weapons, and I have to take my shoes off and go through the x-ray machine, it's not because people want to blow the plane up in the name of Christianity. Sure, Christians did nasty stuff in the name of their religion a long time ago and still do some bad things today, but I think it has evolved since then, and Islam has evolved.... not as much. Some would say this makes me a racist.
I'm curious. When people complained about the Christians and their crusades nearly a thousand years ago, were those people labeled as "racists"? Should they have been? Did people point out the faults of pagan Slavs (which were killed along with Muslims) to negate what was being done by Christians?
We have to accept islam.... pc correct... Maybe many would wish them to go home... But in true skeptic fashion... nothing like throwing Chit in your face.. probably makes his pathetic day better!
loner,
Skeptic is good at this sorta thing.
Why give him "chit" over it?
Your probably right... However it is bad timing with recent events... I feel he is being an insensitive person... Maybe he plans on marching in the next parade yelling Allahu Akbar... just cause he can!
Yos_sam,
It must be viral in Abrahamic religions. The Christians and Jews have one or more Messiahs and Islam is waiting their savior who is called the "Mahdi." He will join forces with Jesus on Judgment Day. The Mahdi ( "Guided One") will stick around to rule over the earth for seven, nine or nineteen years (depending on who you believe) straightening things out before the Resurrection Day arrives.
- He will be a descendant of Muhammad;
- He will redistribute wealth;
- His coming will be accompanied by the appearance of the Dajjal ('Great Deceiver'). (Bush?)
- There will be both a lunar and solar eclipse within the month of Ramadan
- A star with a luminous tail will rise from the east.
- He will restore Islam to its original form and eradicate moral corruption.
- He will fight for the cause of Islam and it will prevail throughout the world
- He will have a broad forehead, a big nose and his eyes will be naturally dark. Some say he will be blind in one eye.
- He will fill the world with justice and fairness.
(Not all Muslims buy into the Mahdi thing).
auburntom,
After Sept 11, 2001, nine Arab airline carriers enacted in-flight security measures. These included Lebanon, Jordan, Morocco, Saudi Arabia and Egypt. So if you flew, say, Libyan Arab Airlines, you might get your tools confiscated by a Muslim instead of by a Christian. How fair is that?
You don't have to reach way back to the Crusades; until a few years ago the Ku Klux Klan engaged in arson, beatings, cross burning, lynching, murder, rape, tar-and-feathering, property destruction and whippings in the name of American Terrorism for sweet baby Jeezuz (not the Jewish one; the blond one).
Skeptic, regarding the Arab airlines, I have no idea what point you're trying to make, but of course they would have the same security. After all, Islamic terrorists kill far more Muslims in the name of Islam than westerners, for the simple reason that it's easier to kill Muslims in a Muslim country.
Regarding the KKK, I find your mindset on this interesting. Sure, the KKK were a bunch of evil %^@*&s, but Islamic terrorists have killed more people in just the last two days (25) than the KKK have killed in the last 50 years (20). In its 144 year history, the KKK killed around two thousand people; a few months work for Islamic terrorism. I find it interesting that you would equate these two, and I have to wonder what motivates you.
So yes, we don't have to reach back to the Crusades, but the key word is "reach". Why are you reaching to such a ridiculous extent? What are you trying to prove?
Christianity, Islam and Judaism all have the same motivation to kill in the name of their One True God. Each monotheistic religion exercises that motivation as often as possible. Terrific argument against monotheism, don't you agree?
Gee Skeptic, I'm gonna have to admit my ignorance here, and I had to look up monotheism before I could even reply. It seems to mean belief in one God, but perhaps you mean a culture dominated by one religion? Either way, I don't think I agree with you. Religions don't exercise motivation, people do. Religions have their dark side, but they also have their good side. Many people, even Muslims, do many wonderful things in the name of their religion. It really comes down to what people do with it. I think culture plays a very important and unrecognized role, and many people just use religion as an excuse or reason to do what is already inherent in their personality and/or culture. I said that Christianity has evolved, but to put it more accurately, the societies that have practiced Christianity have evolved. In the end I am for freedom, whether that freedom leads to monotheism or whether it leads to no religion at all, as long as the resulting beliefs don't impose on other people's freedoms.
Nonsense. With or without religion you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for essentially good people to do really evil things, that takes religion. If a man today followed literally the teachings of the Old Testament, he would be a criminal. If he would follow literally the teachings of the New Testament, he would be declared insane.
But I couldn't agree more with your last sentence. Freedom of, and freedom from, religion is basic to all other human freedoms.
skeptic in your last post you addressed the evils of the old and new testament but you omitted any reference to the Koran. Could it be that it also makes criminals out of those that take it too literally?
Would you consider the Fort Hood incident a case of terrorism? Would you consider it the first case of terrorism on American soil since 9-11-2001.
I don't follow any religion so I'm somewhat neutral when it comes to them, to each his or her own, I think it is a very bad topic of discussion.
The Qur’an is broken up into 114 chapters called “Suras.” Muslims believe that Allah himself gave the Qur'an to the angel Gabriel. As the story goes, Gabriel then dictated it to the Prophet Muhammad, in intervals, over a period of twenty-three years from 610 to the time of Muhammad’s death in 632.
Q. Is there a possibility that the Qur’an could be an authentic revelation from God? Not a chance. There are many reasons the Qur’an can be rejected as authentic, God-revealed Scripture. Here are just four.
1. The Qur’an Contradicts Authentic Scripture (ie. The Bible - a book that uniquely, among all other religious literature, provides hundreds of fulfilled prophecies as proof of it’s divine inspiration). How does the Qur’an contradict the Bible? The god of Islam does not love sinners, that itself could qualify. In addition, the Qur’an teaches that salvation comes by works, not by God’s grace. Sura 23:102-3 says, “Then those whose balance (of good deeds) is heavy, they will attain salvation: But those whose balance is light, will be those who have lost their souls, in Hell will they abide.” Sura 18:107 reads, “As to those who believe and work righteous deeds, they have, for their entertainment, the Gardens of Paradise”
2. The Qur’an Contradicts Known Facts of Science. The Qur’an, like other ancient religious writings, has made some serious errors when it comes to science. Errors that prove that it can not be the product of an omniscient, divine mind: one example - in Sura 18:86 the Qur’an speaks of Alexander the Great traveling west until he actually finds the place where the sun sets. Sura 18:86, “till, when he reached the setting-place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring”. David, who wrote in the Bible about 1,600 years before Muhammad was even born, said insightfully that rather than the sun setting in a muddy spring, it was actually on a circuit through space (Ps. 19:6).
3. The Qur’an Contradicts Known Facts of History. One of the most well-attested facts of history is that Jesus of Nazareth was put to death on a cross. It is a fact of history so well confirmed by historical sources, even outside of the Bible, that even the most liberal of scholars—like those who are part of the Jesus Seminar—consider it an undisputable fact. And yet, the Qur’an makes a fatal error by saying that this event never occurred. Sura 4:157 says, “and for claiming that they killed the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the messenger of GOD. In fact, they [speaking of the JEWS] never killed him, they never crucified him - they were made to think that they did. All factions who are disputing in this matter are full of doubt concerning this issue. They possess no knowledge; they only conjecture. For certain, they never killed him.”
The New Testament is a collection of documents written down within the first generation after the events, while the eyewitnesses were still alive, that has been validated by archeological discoveries and the writings of secular sources like the Jewish Talmud, the Roman historian Flavius Josephus and others.
The QUR’AN is a book written 600 years later by men who were hundreds of miles and centuries removed from the events. I’ll trust the New Testament, over the Qur’an any day. The authors of the New Testament were there and they were willing to even lose their lives preaching the message of the cross.
4. There are no particularly good reasons to accept the Qur’an as inspired Scripture. The most popular proof Muslims give for the inspiration of the Qur'an is the Qur’an’s literary beauty and eloquence. Muslims believe it is unsurpassed. Muslims believe that it is so beautiful in what it says that it could have only come from God. Sura 10:37 says, “This Qur’an could not possibly be authored by [any] other than GOD.” But, this is a highly questionable means of testing a document for divine inspiration. If beauty and eloquence is a means of proving divine inspiration and authority, well then what’s to stop us from believing that Shakespeare’s writings were inspired? They were very beautiful and eloquent, but we wouldn’t believe that they are divinely authoritative.
loomisresident - Yes. Taking scripture - any scripture - literally can be dangerous to those around you. That's my point. Thank you.
If the Fort Hood shooting-spree is proved to be terrorism, it wouldn't be the first case of domestic terrorism since 9-11.
Domestic terrorist groups like the Army of God attack abortion providers across the United States, blowing up clinics and killing doctors, clinic employees and even security guards. The Centennial Olympic Park Bombing in 1986 was carried out by two domestic terrorist groups, Christian Identity and Christian Patriots, both of whom have ties to the terrorist organization Lambs of Christ.
An American Christian group called Concerned Citizens was deported when it was caught planning attacks on holy places in Jerusalem. When questioned, Concerned Citizens said it believed their suicide attacks would "lead them to heaven." Concerned Christians was one of several Christian terrorist groups who believe the al-Aqsa Mosque has to be destroyed to enable the second coming of Jesus Christ.
LB - I won't argue with that, Gordon.
But there are no particularly good reasons to accept the Bible as inspired scripture, either.
It is filled with contradictions, invented history, mistranslation, scribal errors, corrections, editorials, redaction, outright forgeries, and after-the-fact glosses, that it appears to be little more than a loose collection of tall tales written by scores of scribes of varying literary skills over many, many centuries. Did you know that no two ancient manuscripts of the Gospels agree with each other? The Bible did not attain standard wording until the invention of the printing press. With the possible exception of Psalms, it utterly fails as poetry, too. But wasn't it clever of the Hebrew god to compose his very own book in Greek - - and to not compose it better? If this is the best work that an allegedly omnipotent, omniscient, summum bonum, triune deity can do, I am not impressed.
nothing about anybody's religion makes any sense whatsoever.
maybe that's the point.
if you looked into the eyes of the enemies' child and for that child's sake prayed for peace between you
and it happened
call it Good or call it God.
It's all the same to the child.
progressive4values -
You understand.
"Concepts create idols; only wonder understands anything." (St. Gregory of Nyssa, Mystic, theologian, humanist; ca. 335 - 394 CE).
I see you are confusing the quran ith the Bible again.
Skeptic, Mahdi sounds like Obama.
Margaritas ante porcos, Skeptic - margaritas ante porcos. Good post, though.
Some believe that the Mahdi has already come. See: The Báb